the Enemy(?) and Ideas they gave me.

General discussion about anything related to Transcendence.
shanejfilomena
Fleet Officer
Fleet Officer
Posts: 1483
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:43 pm
Location: Alaska

Wed Jun 08, 2011 4:01 am

Originally I took flight in the Universe with the Idea I was shooting Military targets : targets Armed and Hostile towards both the CommonWealth and My Ship.
However, as I flew the great expanse I started to realize there was information about these " Targets" that I could discover :
I started to look at the Pirates and differences in their organizations, weapons and skills ; I started to watch the other "Hostiles" and quickly began to wonder if I am really fighting on the right side against Military targets or am I fighting scared, under-funded groups that are outcast by Decker and the CommonWealth-Powers-that-be.


The entire point of the Musing is that I think many players want to know WHY they are killing these creatures:
and I was inspired by the Dwarg Raiders not really being Military pilots but slaves ;
the Huari inspired me to no end because it was one hostile that lets you into their world and lets you learn more about them.

there are wiki / sovereign pages that need to be filed in and I think if we can start to get inside and talk to these Hostiles, we can get the information for the rest of the pilots to arm themselves with.....get a good back story going....

The Point is to NOT stop killing.....but try to get inside and understand the target...make the real bad ones stronger if they are weak so they are a challenge : such as Charon....those critters refused to come to the meeting, they are just begging to get shot.

I kind of feel bad for the Centauri(?) soo underfunded ....( THey were once invited to a party at StartOn Eridani...Decker had the fleet attack them as they left the party......)
Last edited by shanejfilomena on Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:46 am, edited 2 times in total.
Flying Irresponsibly In Eridani......

I don't like to kill pirates in cold blood ..I do it.. but I don't like it..

User avatar
Harbringer
Miner
Miner
Posts: 26
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:37 pm

Wed Jun 08, 2011 8:20 am

What was this about? It doesn't seems to make sense to me(no offense intended).
1. Are you trying to say that enemies should be stronger?
2. Or are you making a mod?
Yay. I have an internet connection again.

shanejfilomena
Fleet Officer
Fleet Officer
Posts: 1483
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:43 pm
Location: Alaska

Thu Jun 09, 2011 3:36 am

Harbringer wrote:What was this about? It doesn't seems to make sense to me(no offense intended).
1. Are you trying to say that enemies should be stronger?
2. Or are you making a mod?
Actually , yes, it made sense " at the time" :)
Flying Irresponsibly In Eridani......

I don't like to kill pirates in cold blood ..I do it.. but I don't like it..

User avatar
alterecco
Fleet Officer
Fleet Officer
Posts: 1658
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 3:08 am
Location: Previously enslaved by the Iocrym

Thu Jun 09, 2011 5:37 am

But it doesn't now? :D

shanejfilomena
Fleet Officer
Fleet Officer
Posts: 1483
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:43 pm
Location: Alaska

Thu Jun 09, 2011 6:18 am

alterecco wrote:But it doesn't now? :D
It does on the thinking that I am trying to get into the minds of the Hostiles with my .xml ideas ( which is why it seems so Alien because thats the road Iam going down ): not take away the fact that the same faction will kill the player....but I think if we get a better understanding of a population and the politics of the commonwealth :
.....did it not bother you that Decker would rather kill Helios then let her stand trial at the Court Martial?

I thinks something is rotten in StK and it's not just Decker.
Flying Irresponsibly In Eridani......

I don't like to kill pirates in cold blood ..I do it.. but I don't like it..

rincewind
Commonwealth Pilot
Commonwealth Pilot
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2011 12:47 pm
Location: Reno NV

Thu Jun 09, 2011 8:06 pm

What you wish is what humanity has wished for thousands of years. Why do people who think different. look different or act different cause us to want to change them or kill them? Why are the Centauri underfunded and disliked by Decker. Maybe a couple hundred years ago they were much stronger and allied with a Whack Job Dictator who wanted to erase all of humanity from history. Perhaps the Huari are so Egotistical that when things go good they run they're mouths and superior ego's But when invariably attacked by superior force will take any help they can get. The Anarchists just want everyone to live the hippie dream and if you don't like it they kill you. You want to know why they attack? They attack because no matter how much we wish differently games are based on someone's version of humanity or what they think or want it to be. Just like the mods we make. Or the books we write. Or whatever we do.

User avatar
RPC
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
Posts: 2876
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2011 5:21 am
Location: Hmm... I'm confused. Anybody have a starmap to the Core?

Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:37 am

did it not bother you that Decker would rather kill Helios then let her stand trial at the Court Martial?
You know, killing so many space pirates before getting to the Decker part in the game made me insensitive to all the killing. When he said that.... I just went with it. I never even questioned it. Now, if you want to illuminate the player about the different factions in the game, it depends upon their interactions with them. How do you meet them? Enemies on the radar? Interacting through the dockscreen?

Vanilla just lets you meet them as enemies, but maybe if you add a new dimension of interaction, you might find the path to what you want to do.
Tutorial List on the Wiki and Installing Mods
Get on Discord for mod help and general chat
Image
Image
Der Tod ist der zeitlose Frieden und das leben ist der Krieg
Wir müssen wissen — wir werden wissen!
I don't want any sort of copyright on my Transcendence mods. Feel free to take/modify whatever you want.

rincewind
Commonwealth Pilot
Commonwealth Pilot
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2011 12:47 pm
Location: Reno NV

Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:40 am

I understand what you are saying but writing fictional history is just as hard as writing real history. Ultimately it is up to George. I remember the Ur Quan Masters they had a very explainable universe but I also think they had a few more then one person making decisions. They're are several mods I have played that radically change the dynamics of the game some have a history some don't. My Discworld Mod will include some history of the Disc and Rincewinds quest for Boredom. That is easy but once you create a backstory you have to get into details. We would need to write a history with several contributors and that could go all bad. Especially when the contributors are not familiar with each other. Think if we told George Bush to write the history of the Huari and Jimmy Carter write the history of the Sung. Perhaps creating a Forum where we could throw ideas around. Maybe we could come up with a consensus and maybe not. It may be worth a look.

Amariithynar
Militia Commander
Militia Commander
Posts: 255
Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2011 9:58 pm

Fri Jun 10, 2011 3:11 pm

Ur Quan Masters (the free version of the Toys for Bob game Star Control II, go get it!) was pretty much done by a small team of people taking the 3DO source code that was released and tinkering with it further. Most of the big decisions were just done between the two co-creators of Toys for Bob, though they did have Starflight's lead designer, i think it was, writing some of the dialog for them.

For a more modern take on Star Control/Ur Quan Masters, see Mass Effect.

erik dela cruz
Militia Captain
Militia Captain
Posts: 610
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2011 7:45 pm
Location: Patrolling Scarborough Shoal and the Spratlys Islands (West Philippine Sea)

Fri Jun 10, 2011 8:19 pm

What is the discussion all about again? :?:
.....cry without weeping......
.....talk without speaking......
.....scream without raising your voice......

shanejfilomena
Fleet Officer
Fleet Officer
Posts: 1483
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:43 pm
Location: Alaska

Sat Jun 11, 2011 7:19 am

RPC wrote:
did it not bother you that Decker would rather kill Helios then let her stand trial at the Court Martial?
You know, killing so many space pirates before getting to the Decker part in the game made me insensitive to all the killing. When he said that.... I just went with it. I never even questioned it. Now, if you want to illuminate the player about the different factions in the game, it depends upon their interactions with them. How do you meet them? Enemies on the radar? Interacting through the dockscreen?

Vanilla just lets you meet them as enemies, but maybe if you add a new dimension of interaction, you might find the path to what you want to do.
got it covered from Eridani out......I just have a problem with all the wrecks it leaves behind.....maybe it's just me but I don't like the place littered with military stuff that i think could unbalance the game by giving the player access to them too early:
I am working on it now: I want a relative cross between salvager and drone.....or ill have to ask Domina to clear the wrecks for me.
Flying Irresponsibly In Eridani......

I don't like to kill pirates in cold blood ..I do it.. but I don't like it..

shanejfilomena
Fleet Officer
Fleet Officer
Posts: 1483
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:43 pm
Location: Alaska

Sat Jun 11, 2011 7:27 am

rincewind wrote:IThat is easy but once you create a backstory you have to get into details..
Details are what kills me: I work for a long time on the .xml I publish ( notice there is only one out right now : I have several )
the thing is the details of missions and history and battle scenes and you want to make it all believable as the universe your playing in.

Unlike the auviq I published, the Rogue Command has working missions: ( yay!) and I got the Hospital to work right ( that was a huge let down in the Auviq because I made all those Oranges for the Hospital.......)

But working on details is the entire thing: I just spent hours searching for " unmatched quote " ( they match ) and figured out that the problem was not the quotes: it was the spacing.
Flying Irresponsibly In Eridani......

I don't like to kill pirates in cold blood ..I do it.. but I don't like it..

rincewind
Commonwealth Pilot
Commonwealth Pilot
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2011 12:47 pm
Location: Reno NV

Sat Jun 11, 2011 2:59 pm

When I write I get the whole outline done first then add details as I rewrite it. Our experience and for lack of a better work edumacation leads to the details. For instance I love to write detective thrillers(yes I have thought about a Nero Wolfe Mod the Ferrians did it.) Since I have fired 6 guns in my entire life it can be hard deciding what and with how many details to arm them. Then once they are armed I am prepared for the people who think it should be different. Details are difficult but if you are doing it for your own pleasure rather then commerce things are fairly simple. I did not pay for this game therefore I may complain about certain things but never the mods themselves because I have not earned that right. On the other hand if I had dropped 50 bucks on the game I would bust balls especially on mods. This is one of the finest games I have ever played, the people who play it and comment on it make it special for me because we all seem to get along and quite frankly you folks are about the only people other then my wife that I would willingly have a conversation with. One more point about details they are all around us we just need to translate them into idea's. For instance my detective only eats onion bagels. Why because I do most of my writing at the kitchen table and when I needed a bread product it was that or generic wheat bread. So if you need to hijack details just look at your normal surroundings and get the idea's. One more word on writing fiction do not use your wife as a foil she will get highly offended when she reads she is not a standard 6 ft blonde but rather a frumpy old spinster.

User avatar
Wolfy
Fleet Admiral
Fleet Admiral
Posts: 5389
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2008 1:10 am
Location: Somewhere in the Frontier on a Hycrotan station, working on new ships.

Sun Jun 12, 2011 7:37 pm

You're right; the CW isn't all nice & shiny as it likes to present itself - I mean, the extensive slums you see even in st.ks is a good illustration of that. Pity that you don't really get to explore all the other facets of even just the QZ in the vanilla game. The CW is mostly looking out for itself and the corporations: and even then, if you look at the Ranx (who's origins were in a secession from the CW), the CW clearly will sacrifice some parts of itself to save others.

The interesting thing about the Ares on the other hand is that while they have a nearly internally utopian society, their current leadership is rather omnicidal, though its not to say that all the sects are like that, as evidenced by those who contacted Helios.

In Decker's defense, Helios /did/ disobey his order, and it wasn't all that unlikely it would have been a trap, especially considering they have been at war for long over a century. (The Antares I design is 150 years old; and its post-syrtian war)
(shpOrder gPlayership 'barrelRoll)
(plySetGenome gPlayer (list 'hycrotan 'nonBinary))
Image
Homelab Servers: Xeon Silver 4110, 16GB | Via Quadcore C4650, 16GB | Athlon 200GE, 8GB | i7 7800X, 32GB | Threadripper 1950X, 32GB | Atom x5 8350, 4GB | Opteron 8174, 16GB
Workstations & Render machines: Threadripper 2990WX, 32GB, 2x 1080ti | Xeon Platinum 8173M, 48GB, 1070ti | R9 3900X, 16GB, Vega64 | 2x E5 2430L v2, 24GB, 970
Office Systems: 2x Xeon Silver 4116, 96GB, 2x 1080ti | i7 3770, 16GB, some old quadro | i5 3210m, 8GB | some i7 macbook
Misc Systems: R5 3500U, 20GB | R5 2400G, 16GB | i5 7640X, 16GB, Vega56 | E5 2620, 8GB, R5 260 | P4 1.8ghz, 0.75GB, Voodoo 5 5500 | Athlon 64 x2 4400+, 1.5GB, FX 5800 Ultra | Pentium D 3.2ghz, 4GB, 7600gt | Celeron g460, 8GB, 730gt | 2x Athlon FX 74, 8GB, 8800gts 512 | FX 9590, 16GB, R9 295x2 | E350, 8GB | Phenom X4 2.6ghz, 16GB, 8800gt | random core2 duo/atom/i5/i7 laptops

shanejfilomena
Fleet Officer
Fleet Officer
Posts: 1483
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:43 pm
Location: Alaska

Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:01 pm

Decker should have let her stand trial and not send the fleet to kill the ship : here is my idea of a scenario :

the fleet assassins should have come to arrest /helios and escort her back to the capital: this activates as the player goes through the encounter : but instead of the the fleet attacking first: Helios fights depending on the player's option chosen : an Ares attack equal to the Sung Battle scene over the temple but the fleet ships " hold" unless the playership takes more then 60% damage : then they activate all weapons to defend themselves and the player..... IF the player / player with help secures the ship's safety : it finds the Aquila's escorting the csc ( but hold for docking so the player get a reward before taking Helios to answer to Pariliment )

to just go after the csc is a nice battle scene but ....I still do not think it fits wit the idea that your " doing the right thing for the right side " if you can be tried / court martial but they can't........

of course: Us mere mortals can not code THAT
Flying Irresponsibly In Eridani......

I don't like to kill pirates in cold blood ..I do it.. but I don't like it..

Post Reply