Economics, Money Sinks, and New Playing Styles

General discussion about anything related to Transcendence.
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TranscendentGeek
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Sat Dec 29, 2012 9:27 am

This thread is for discussion the economics in the game and for generating future modding ideas. Some questions to start it off.

Is it too easy or too hard to make credits/rins?
If not are you using one of the mining mods like MP to increase your net worth?
Is trading a viable option in the game or does it need work?
If not how could it be improved?
Do ships drop good loot ie valuable/useful?
If not what would make drops better?
Do stations provide enough information for trading?
If not what information is lacking?
Do unidentified items help or hurt playability?

Please add any other questions or comments as necessary.

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Sun Dec 30, 2012 8:57 pm

Is it too easy or too hard to make credits/rins?
Somewhat difficult at first (if not mining). Then it becomes easy once Teraton fabricators become accessible.

The game has ways to get useful goods or services that bypass the standard credit/rin economies. For example, donating items to get something worth far more than selling the items, and feeding the infamous Teraton fabricator.

Fuel is a huge money sink. So much that solar armor is the only armor I use until I can access other cheap fuel tricks late in the game. Fuel rods are valuable commodities; better tendered than consumed.
Is trading a viable option in the game or does it need work?
It works if you know how (and are able) to get the best deals. Such information is lacking in the game.
If not how could it be improved?
Short of an ingame journal, maybe a few hints here and there, preferably those that do not require a visit to the rumor mill, which costs money and may randomly yield something useless instead of something useful.

Also, the player needs to know how buying limits work. Otherwise, the player can easily shaft himself by selling hard earned loot for nothing.
Do ships drop good loot ie valuable/useful?
Early on, with Centauri and Charon pirates, loot is minimal, as in a few fuel rods and a damaged common and/or junk item. The best loot you get early is missiles for NAMI launcher, fuel rods to stockpile, and anything Tinkers can use for custom work. After St. K's, farming ships becomes lucrative. Huari, Ventari, and larger Ares ships are loot pinatas, and they keep coming as long as their station is spared. At that point of the game, even mid to high level damaged items are valuable thanks to the fabricator.
If not what would make drops better?
For early game, the only thing can could drop more is ammo like MAGs and Strelkas. I never use MAGs or Strelkas because most ships do not drop them (and those that do tend to be friendlies or gladiators). Why spend money on the ammo when I can get plenty of useful missiles for the NAMI launcher from the wrecks of pirate ships.
Do stations provide enough information for trading?
If not what information is lacking?
No. How buying limits work and base price of items. Shops do not need to tell the player this information, but the player should have a way to access this information in the game.
Do unidentified items help or hurt playability?
Unidentified items in Transcendence have been executed badly, and are a major annoyance.
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Vachtra
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Mon Dec 31, 2012 10:13 pm

My much simpler answer is just this.
Transcendence is one of those games that has a learning curve. When I first played Rogue it was similar. I didn't know what to do for the most part except loot and kill, often in that order. Trans is a lot like that. As I have played it over the years I have developed a more though out strategy and it's easier to win and for the most part it always works. I say for the most part only due to user error.
It's easy enough once you figure it out but difficult enough to be fun, not too difficult in the beginning to keep you trying.
Note: I never use teraton fabricators, they're not necessary, and nothing past sustain from Domina and then rarely, I hate starting over for nothing.
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Atarlost
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Tue Jan 01, 2013 4:51 am

TranscendentGeek wrote:This thread is for discussion the economics in the game and for generating future modding ideas. Some questions to start it off.

Is it too easy or too hard to make credits/rins?
If not are you using one of the mining mods like MP to increase your net worth?
Is trading a viable option in the game or does it need work?
If not how could it be improved?
Do ships drop good loot ie valuable/useful?
If not what would make drops better?
Do stations provide enough information for trading?
If not what information is lacking?
Do unidentified items help or hurt playability?

Please add any other questions or comments as necessary.
In vanilla it's a little hard to get rin. Fortunately the highest priced items tend to unnecessary. It's sometimes possible to get level 10 armor from non-rin shops and it's entirely possible to play with no level 9 or 10 weapons, though since the "ultimate" weapon is a quest reward that doesn't require rins you don't have to. That really just leaves shields as a big ticket rin buy. Picking up longzhus and other enhancers is pretty cheap if you save up compact ringer valuables all game.

I don't mine. Can't stand to lose the slots to do something that isn't really fun for me anyways.

Trading is viable sometimes. A couple of important trading stations are rather rare, but the fuel->ice farm->hotel route is usually reliable and occasionally factories will want something like liquid hydrogen that you can buy somewhere. Not always though even as many are concentrated in Incandescent orbit. Factories that sell hotel fodder, though, are pretty common.

Having stations tell you what they want would be great. Selling at Ice Farms is really high profit, but you wouldn't know about it without spoilers.

Some ships drop good loot, some don't. Gunships are generally pretty terrible, though some carry ammo that's useful.

All capital ships should probably carry reactors or none should. The pinata gap between a Ventari or Huari destroyer and anything Sung or Dwarg is huge even though Earth Slavers and Behemoths carry random loot and Ventari and Huari destroyers don't. More variety of ammo using enemies would be nice as well to make MAGs and Strelkas more viable.

Stations do not provide enough information for trading. I think I already answered this under the question of what could improve trading.

Unidentified items are terrible. ID by use is a pain when you have to go to a station to replace armor ruined by bad barrels or devices ruined by bad ROMs or crystals or algorithm cubes and have to go to a station to install unknown devices and still don't learn what you installed unless you happen to have something it's compatible with.
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KA101
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Mon Jan 21, 2013 8:22 am

"Pinata gap": probably the best term I've read on the forum. Good one.

Agreed that item-ID is a pain: Tech Analyzer FTW.

Trading: made straightforward by mods, sorry.

Damaged items are a crock: either useless vendor-trash (vanilla until Teraton fabs) or an excellent profit/upgrade source (Almighty Wrench). They remind me sufficiently of the Diablo 2 Ethereal-tag that I don't mind using the Wrench. Idea: let the player/Tinkers cannibalize them for parts so X number of damaged thermo weapons converts to a thermo upgrade, etc.

Fuel: Solar panel, maybe solar armor, but the only reactor upgrades I buy are the Sol/Helios ones. Fuel items run out and infrastructure to supply them cannot be presumed present past Heretic, RMP/mining gear notwithstanding. Stars, on the other hand, can. Solar reactors are the only responsible way to fly IMO.

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