Mining Changes

[Periculi]

I've never actually liked the idea of mining weapons. Anyone ever think that maybe a robot could do it better? Rather than blasting away at space rocks with the playership, perhaps a whole new paradigm would be in order:

Scanners (ranged) take a device slot or two and allow targeting an asteroid and running a scan to detect ore. Playership mining scanner would work in conjunction with additional specific mining equipment:

Mining Drone -
When ore is detected, launch a miner drone (equipment takes up cargo space) - which then dock with the asteroid and set up mining operation, drone and/or mining post can be destroyed (total loss of equip and ore) and take a little time to fill up. Once full, mining droid returns to playership (mining hold required) for post-extraction processing (more equipment needed perhaps).

Mining Mule - similar to the above, but works like a regular auton as far as being able to follow player around and possibly also combined with a mining mule auton to store greater quantity of ores.

[Aury]

Once again, with the level of equipment involved, any large-scale mining I think should be done by large mining-specific rigs and barges; light-scale minimal mining (which could be done with just weapons as it's simple but not terribly effective at getting all the ore) could still be done by the player.

That mining mule (basically an auton designed to carry ore) idea I've already implemented in my EI75 mining auton, and one of the rig/barge ideas I had was to have the rig do the ore extraction, and the autons launched to go pick up the ore that's created, and then have them re-dock at the rig which can do whatever else is needed.

[Prophet]

I think you're both right, in that mining is much easier and efficient when scaled up. That being said, there's nothing stopping anyone in real life, right now from taking a shovel and going mining. Can you make a living at it? Definitely not, could you maybe find a few interesting things if you were in the right spot and invested enough time? Probably.

I'm positive that in the transcendence universe there are mining operations that function like you are talking about and it would be very neat to see these barges and auton fleets in action. However, the player's goal is to get to the core, and mining (actually more like scavenging) is a way to make a quick buck. The mining system should meld with the motif of the rest of the game which is (for the most part) a lonely pilgrim on a journey.



I personally enjoy tycoon games and strategy games with resource management and tech progression etc but it just doesn't fit this game. I've considered it and it would be great in a total conversion mod like TX2 or a persistent game universe.

[Prophet]

I almost forgot, I've almost finished the mining code and am trying to get it balanced, any help/suggestions are welcome.
You can download it and try it out here.

NO MORE DOCKSCREENS ore is picked up by flying into it (it will damage your hull if not properly protected. You still need a minersHold to be installed.
2 new mining weapons added
Water jet - uses water Ice as ammo. it's a primary weapon and reloads itself automatically from any water ice in your hold. It has ridiculously short range (a ships length) but is unmatched at extracting low grade ore.
Kinetic Drill - Basically a flenser with mining ability. Not tested yet.
Still hoping to add more.
I've introduced Gases into asteroids which require specialized mining tools to extract (not fully incorporated yet) The gas is ejected as particle sprays that you must fly through to collect.
Asteroids will drop some ore when damaged by non-mining weapons but is restricted to lower grade ore and the yield is cut in half.


Future ambitions:
I plan on overwriting the mining station to add an information area, explaining how to mine, what is needed and what to expect. the mine will also buy ore from the player (rather than sell it) and they will offer a variety of mining equipment for sale. The missions will be expanded and hopefully an XP and level system for mining will be available.
I've also roughed out some random mining-related encounters similar to the Ronins and weapon's cache (suggested by oddbob) and hopefully some others.
I'd also like to introduce a mid/late game mining station/ship (suggested by Aeonic) to maintain the usefullness of mining throughout the game.

Any help/suggestions/comments are welcome.

[schilcote]

I've never actually liked the idea of mining weapons. Anyone ever think that maybe a robot could do it better? Rather than blasting away at space rocks with the playership, perhaps a whole new paradigm would be in order:

Scanners (ranged) take a device slot or two and allow targeting an asteroid and running a scan to detect ore. Playership mining scanner would work in conjunction with additional specific mining equipment:

Mining Drone -
When ore is detected, launch a miner drone (equipment takes up cargo space) - which then dock with the asteroid and set up mining operation, drone and/or mining post can be destroyed (total loss of equip and ore) and take a little time to fill up. Once full, mining droid returns to playership (mining hold required) for post-extraction processing (more equipment needed perhaps).

Mining Mule - similar to the above, but works like a regular auton as far as being able to follow player around and possibly also combined with a mining mule auton to store greater quantity of ores.

There is an automatic miner on Xelerus. There's also an automatic "janitor" that loots and destroys wrecks. I modified the latter to make a self upgrading auton, but it didn't work very well.

[Atarlost]

I wouldn't flip the mining station from selling ore to buying. I think mining station to corporate enclave is a viable trade route (15% gap according to xml) and we shouldn't shaft traders in our quest to improve mining.

I also think that water jet should not be an ore mining tool. It would be perfect for mining gas because it's a low energy tool.

[Aury]

I think you're both right, in that mining is much easier and efficient when scaled up. That being said, there's nothing stopping anyone in real life, right now from taking a shovel and going mining. Can you make a living at it? Definitely not, could you maybe find a few interesting things if you were in the right spot and invested enough time? Probably.

I'm positive that in the transcendence universe there are mining operations that function like you are talking about and it would be very neat to see these barges and auton fleets in action. However, the player's goal is to get to the core, and mining (actually more like scavenging) is a way to make a quick buck. The mining system should meld with the motif of the rest of the game which is (for the most part) a lonely pilgrim on a journey.



I personally enjoy tycoon games and strategy games with resource management and tech progression etc but it just doesn't fit this game. I've considered it and it would be great in a total conversion mod like TX2 or a persistent game universe.

I wasn't suggesting that it be the player doing that heavy-duty mining, and was saying to the contrary that the player should stick with low-resource intensive light mining. XD

[Aeonic]

Personally I like the idea of being able to purchase autons or something similar which you can assign to mine asteroids, perhaps sending many of them out at once, and then optionally guarding them while they mine. Would take a lot of the tedious work away from the player, who can either be doing something else or blasting bad guys to protect their interests while they're waiting. Perhaps setting up some sentry drones or escort ships to protect them while the player does something else.

I realize its not very compatible with what Prophet is currently working on, but it still sounds nice.

[Atarlost]

To get down to the game design level: what player skill is necessary for mining?
...

One other big issue: The mini-game has to be compatible with the rest of the game. In other words:

A. Mining cannot be more viable than any other path.
B. Mining must be a trade-off (i.e., you must give up something in another path)
...

Having someone else mine for you doesn't really satisfy either of George's conditions.

[alterecco]

Having someone else mine for you doesn't really satisfy either of George's conditions.

Perhaps if controlling mining autons was considered a complex task and required the use of a slot for a device that enabled this behaviour. That would satisfy both Georges criteria imo.

[schilcote]

All you really would need is a shield that recharges faster than the asteroids can drain it, and some radiation-immune armor.

That translates to any shield other than a cyclotron or superconducting shields... XD

What about a shield that is strengthened by the radiation? (ie, radiation field's damage adds HP to the shield instead of subtract it, or perhapse stats boosts in it?) /just random ideas/

Very interesting. Is this possible currently? It would be neat to have shields that gain HP (or perhaps recharge your reactor?) when hit with a certian damage type, but are relatively weak when hit with other damage types. I.E. if I'm heading into Sung territory, I might purchase a special shield that charges itself and or my reactor when hit with particle damage, but if I bring that shield near some enemies that use kinetic or plasma or laser, I'll get pwnt.

Perhaps have a "shield tuning set" that would cost a lot and allow you to tune your absorption shields to different damage types?

[Aury]

Is this possible currently? It would be neat to have shields that gain HP (or perhaps recharge your reactor?) when hit with a certian damage type

This is indeed possible. Just set a negative damageadj. (the shield will 'regen' back to its normal max however, so if you don't want to loose the boosted HP, set it's regen to 0)

[Atarlost]

Having someone else mine for you doesn't really satisfy either of George's conditions.

Perhaps if controlling mining autons was considered a complex task and required the use of a slot for a device that enabled this behaviour. That would satisfy both Georges criteria imo.

I think that would only satisfy the second, and since you can switch equipment freely maybe only 2B. Having a device slot used doesn't really involve player skill.

[Aeonic]

There are so many fun things you can do with shields, its a shame there aren't more varieties.

[schilcote]

There are so many fun things you can do with shields, its a shame there aren't more varieties.

Well, that's why George made Transcendence so easily modifiable!