Weapon damage observations

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While writing additional weapons for my mods, I compared the stats of my weapons to the standard weapons. After trial and error, I (think I) discovered the damage progression of weapons. Keep in mind that the following is guesswork.

On Damage Per Second (DPS)
At level I, base laser damage is 15, base kinetic damage is 18.
At level IV, base particle damage is 33, and base blast damage is 36.
At level VII, base ion damage is 65, and base thermo damage is 78.
At level X, base positron damage is 135, and base plasma damage 156.

Notice that matter damage is up to 20% greater than an energy damage attack of the same tier.

Notice that positron damage at level X is nine times greater than laser damage at level I. Plasma damage has a similar damage ratio. The cube root of 9 is about equal to 2.08. When damage increases a tier, such as from laser to particle, we can expect the damage to increase by a factor of 2.08 over the last tier of damage from three levels ago. If damage progression holds steady beyond level X, then we have the following numbers for higher tiers of damage.

At level XIII, base antimatter damage is 280, and base nano damage is 335.
At level XVI, base graviton damage is 585, and base singularity damage is 700.
At level XIX, base dark acid damage is 1215, and base dark steel damage is 1458
At level XXII, base dark lightning damage is 2527, and base dark fire damage is 3032.

Damage of its type increases by a factor of four when tech level increases by three. For instance, you can expect DPS of a level IV laser based weapon to be 60. From this, the damage multiplier we can expect when level increases by 1 is cube root of 4, or 1.5874. However, some weapons can be stronger for their level. For instance, the level IV dual turbolaser has DPS of 75 instead of 60. It is, in effect, a level 4.5 weapon. The damage multiplier for half a level is 4 to the one-sixth power, or 1.259921. From the above observations, a table was constructed.

LevelUp / DPS Multiplier
0.0 / 1
0.5 / 1.2599
1.0 / 1.5874
1.5 / 2
2.0 / 2.5198
2.5 / 3.1748
3.0 / 4
3.5 / 5.0397
4.0 / 6.3496
4.5 / 8
5.0 / 10.0793
5.5 / 12.6992
6.0 / 16

Weapon properties affect the effective DPS level of a weapon.

Damage level penalties (tech level increase)
0.5 passthrough="50" or particleSplashChance="50"
0.5 has device or deviceDisrupt
1.0 extremely long range (if howitzer, range 180+; else range 100+)
1.0 howitzer weapon
2.0 omnidirectional or tracking weapon*
4.5 shockwave weapon

* Power use of omnidirectional or tracking weapons is from half to one level lower than normal.

Damage level bonuses (tech level reduction)
0.5 particle style weapon (e.g., PK25, plasma torch)
1.0 causes EMP damage
1.0 requires two weapon slots*
1.0 melee range (range 10 or less)
1.0 uses ammo or charges**
1.0 capacitor or temperature changes by 15 per second of firing
1.0 major quest reward (e.g., Qianlong, Lamplighter)

* Other stats such as cost and powerUse may remain at a level higher.

** Power use of ammo/charge using weapons is three or four levels lower than normal, which is about from 10% to 20% of unlimited use weapons of the same level.

Other notes
Weapons may have up to a half level worth of extra DPS for free. They tend to have some combination of higher cost, powerUse, or shorter range.

Weapons manufactured by Ares have about 90% DPS of standard weapons. They usually have slightly lower powerUse as well.

Radiation does not affect level. It is a tradeoff property. Radiation is guaranteed slow death, but you cannot dock without getting contaminated yourself unless your ship has immunity.
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Opinions based on the above observations:

Stock weapons/ammo that are underpowered:

heavy recoilless cannon: It is only 25% stronger than the light recoilless cannon, which puts it within the upper end of level 1 weapon power. Just lower the level of this weapon down to 1 and call it a day.

Omnidirectional laser cannon: Should be level 2 instead of 3.

dual recoilless cannon: You tell me a dual laser cannon is level 2 while this, a dual version of a slightly underpowered level 1 weapon, is level 3? Lower this to level 2 already!

JB2 shield buster MAG: So, with this mag, I cause 6d6 blast damage per hit (same as the level 4 400 hexagene mag), and whatever damage I roll up gets applied twice to shields? I'd rather take 12d6 (or more) blast damage and cause that much either to shields or armor. If shield busters are to remain useful at level 6, either the blast damage needs to go up, the shield damage rating raised to 4 or 5, or both.

Shuriken Neutron Blaster: It is weaker than the lancer cannon or dual particle beam weapon, but that is only because those two weapons are at the upper limit of level 5 weapon power. The Shuriken's DPS is only slightly below expected level 5 particle damage. What puts this weapon in the underpowered list is its cost - it is too high (and/or the cost of the other two level 5 particle weapons are too low). As a weaker level 5 weapon, its cost should be no higher than 7000.

Dragonfly missile system: Its DPS would be fine if it was an unlimited use weapon. However, it is an ammo weapon, and one with the infamous laser array wide spread. Since this is the Molotok's signature weapon, an easy fix would be to lower its level from 6 to 5, and maybe replace the Military tag with Illegal. If the level must remain at 6, then lower fireRate to 20 (for 3 shots per second).

PM6 Slicer Cannon: It is weaker than the dual particle cannon (fires 10 instead of 12 shots per second), and level 6?! It also has less range and uses more power. Just turn this into a level 5 weapon with lowered powerUse.

TeV-9 blaster: This only has 1.5 DPS higher than the dual particle beam. It is slightly higher than the equivalent of a level 5.5 weapon, which is weak. Just lower fireRate to 14 or 12 for 4.3 or 5 shots per second. As an alternate, remove the Military tag and keep the weapon as it is.

Gotha missiles: It is an ammo weapon, but its long maximum range may negate that bonus. DPS is only 25% higher than level 7 thermo damage, definitely within level 7 bounds. Thus, Gotha-10 missiles should be level 7. Gotha-400 seekers may be fine at level 9.

Gaian Demolition Cannon: DPS is 78, which is the expected damage of a level 7 thermo weapon. Since this weapon uses charges AND requires two weapon slots to install, this could easily be a level 5 weapon. In other words, it is overleveled by four whole levels as a level 9 weapon! Since the player cannot recharge the weapon, the discussion is largely moot.

Heavy ion blaster: While it is within level 9 weapon power range, its DPS (147) below the expected DPS of a level 9 ion weapon (about 164). While this alone does not put it into underpowered range, the addition of 200 MW powerUse does. Either damage should be raised to at least 8d6 per shot, or powerUse be lowered to 150 MW.

Ares Plasma Archcannon: DPS is only 75% within expected level X plasma damage, and the weapon requires two slots to install. (Remember, rate of fire is slower than once per second.) In fact, DPS is less than the level 9 Kytryn blaster, which is at the upper end of level 9 weapon power. With the two slot requirement, the Ares Plasma Archcannon would be fine even as a level 8 weapon, maybe level 9 if WMD7 alone is worth something. This weapon should have one or more of the following: faster firing rate (maybe once per second), more range (to 120) and addition of howitzer tag, or use only one weapon slot like most other weapons. As an alternative, lower the level and powerUse to say, level 9 and 200 MW respectively (and even that would make it weaker than Kytryn blaster other than WMD).

Kytryn Plasma Pod: As an ammo weapon, its DPS (about 140 per shot, 1.5 shots per second) is well within level 10 range. Sure, this missile can cause severe damage if all the fragments hit, but that happens rarely. (I guess that is why only 20% of the fragment damage is shown.) Unless level 11+ weapons scale more slowly, this missile should be fine as at level 10. Its only use right now is to hurt Iocrym and Phobos; other high level thermo missiles are more effective against everything else.

Iocrym repeller: Its damage is on par with the standard, but its range is terrible (13 light-seconds, just slightly beyond melee range) and it pushes things away. It does the job it was designed to do, but as a player weapon, it sucks. Since this weapon is no fun to use, it should be buffed in some way rather than its level lowered to 9.

Positron lancer: The DPS may be the standard, but its powerUse is a bit high for the damage it does. The weapon is also boring. This weapon either should have its powerUse cut down to 300 MW, or have its DPS (and possibly range) increased by speeding up fireRate (to 15) and increasing lifetime for more range, so it feels just like the other lancers.


Stock weapons/ammo that are overpowered:
RK15 Partisan turret: As an omnidirectional weapon, its DPS exceeds that of a level 4.5 weapon, but only by about 1.5. Not much, in other words.

X-ray laser cannon: This has the power of a level 6 laser weapon. However, by the time level 6 weapons are needed, laser damage will be resisted strongly. I am not sure if this weapon needs a downgrade despite having excess damage.

Xenophobe ion lancer: Its DPS of 103 is at or slightly below expected level 8 ion damage! Level should be raised to level 8, and maybe powerUse raised to 90 or 100 like other level 8 weapons. Raised powerUse may not be feasible because worldships and the ark equip several and should not exceed their reactor output. If raising level to 8 is not an option, lower the DPS. Lowering damage would make worldships a bit less deadly to newbies.

Lamplighter archcannon: It has the power of a level 11 weapon, almost level 11.5 in fact. However, it is a reward at the end of a major plot thread near the end of part I, and it is a noted accomplishment on the stat screen. What game doesn't have its purposefully overpowered infinity plus one weapon? The lamplighter is powerful when compared to more basic level 10 weapons, but it still is not too powerful. Since longzhu spheres cannot powerup this weapon, it is not as powerful as a +150% positron lancer, let alone a +150% fracture cannon.

IM90 multitarget blaster: Has level 11 DPS. Since it is a very heavy weapon (only the Gaian Demolition Cannon is heavier), this weapon should take two slots.

Iocrym Fracture Cannon: Has level 11 DPS. Make it use two slots, and increase powerUse to match a level 11 weapon and this will be like a high tech plasma CLAW. Also, how is this an energy weapon that longzhus can power up? Isn't plasma matter type damage?


Other weapon comments:
Bolide blaster: Although within level 2 bounds, it pales in comparison to the fast-fire laser which in turn is weaker than the dual laser cannon. Given that it is an obsolete weapon in canon that is not a problem.

Laser array: Although this has the same DPS as the turbolaser cannon, its somewhat wide spread makes it difficult to hurt things unless the ship as at close range. I suggest raising the laser array's rate of fire to 6 per second (fireRate="10"). That will put its DPS at the upper end of level 3 laser damage, and give the player a reason to use this instead of the turbolaser.

Katana star Cannon: This one is iffy. Without the passthrough, this weapon is just fine. With it, the player can expect at least two hits half of the time on all but the smallest of unarmored targets. That can push DPS to 97+, which is within level 8 range.

Positron Cannon: If we ignore that Ares tend to favor weaker but more efficient weapons, then this weapon has the damage of a level 8.5 weapon, powerUse of a level 8 weapon, and sale cost of a level 9 weapon. I suppose this weapon is fine as a weak level 9, but it should not hurt to increase the damage to 5d8 per shot. 5d8 shots would put its DPS at 84.375, less than a point under expected level 9 positron damage of 85. Consider that Kytryn blaster is a full blown level 9.5 weapon.

Lamplighter Prototype: Including the failure rate, weapon damage is close to a level 10.5 weapon -- not bad. This weapon is not underpowered; it is the Lamplighter that is overpowered.
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ThePrivateer
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Wow...um...yeah just wow. That's a huge post PM, how long did that take you to compile? :shock:

So, out of all of that..."matter' weapons, like kinetic and blast are stronger than energy?

I always thought it was the other way around....so energy uses less power but is less damaging, matter is stronger but uses more power?
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Atarlost
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You misunderstand passthrough. It does not apply to shielded targets, significantly reducing its power. I'm also not sure you're special weapon numbers are right. The fact that you've put them in terms of tech level I think makes them needlessly difficult to use.

Some of my numbers (howitzer) are inconvenient too, but a simple reciprocal fixes that.

Howitzers and weapons with similar roles are a pretty constant 0.8-0.85x normal except the mark I and starcannon.

Ammo weapons pretty solidly do double damage except the smartcannon, which does identical damage to its ammoless cohort indicating tracking is worth double damage. There are some proposed multipliers for ammo weapons and fragmentation. Since George has admitted to not meticulously balancing these I recommend them over empirically derived curves for such weapons.

I do not believe area frags are at all balanced.

The part after the proposed fragmentation weapon adjustments are completely useless because I don't remember what the columns are. They're single effects with a sample of one anyhow so they're pretty much useless.

Code: Select all

laser@1:		15
kinetic@1:		16.875
particle@4:		48
blast@4:		54
ion@7:			153.6
thermo@7:		172.8
positron@10:		491.52
plasma@10:		552.96
antimatter@13:		1572.864

graviton@16:		5033.165
darkAcid@19:		16106.127

old ballista/flenser = 1.22
old heavy slam/markI = 1.08
old tritium/markV = 1.20
old ares-lightning/katana = 0.92
hypothetical thermo8 = avg(tritium adv-tritium) = 114 dps
hypothetical thermo8/FFH = 1.27


old heavy-slam/akan = 52.5/117 = 0.45
old tritium/thermo = 78/156 = 0.5

level 4 blast missile: KM120:	70
old moskva-21:			33.75
old slam:			31.5

KM120/moskva-21 = 2.07
KM120(adj)/moskva-21 = 1.73
km120/slam = 2.22
km120(adj)/slam = 1.85

level 7 thermo missile: Red:	195
level 7 thermo missile: xm900:	150
old tritium:			78

red-strelka/tritium = 2.5
xm900/tritium = 1.92
xm900(adj-tracking)/tritium = 3.85

level 8 thermo missile: Gotha-10:	97.6
old fusionfire:				90
old fusionfire adjusted:		108

gotha/fusionfire = 1.08
gotha/fusionfire(adj) = 0.9

Ammo-weapon curve proposed
m<=60kg	x2
60kg<m<=120kg	x2.5
120kg<m<=200kg	x3
200kg<m<=400kg	x3.5
400kg<m<=800kg	X4


Fragmentation curve proposed (multifrgament)
r<=8		hits in 120 deg
r>8		hits in 180 deg


blinder 2d8+2/15@3	41.25		90
EMP 4d6/20@5		42		70.98
cnidocyst 4d6/15@5	52.5	21.88	36.98
katana 4d6-1/12@7	65	54.17	54.17
Literally is the new Figuratively
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(To Atarlost) I know passthrough does not work on shielded targets. My comment about the Katana Star was not written as clearly as intended. As for fragmentation weapons (and shockwave weapons for that matter), I noticed they are very effective against capital ships and stations.

(To ThePrivateer) I wrote some shorthand notes as I was typing script, so I would not need to open stdweapons.xml and other files repeatedly as I compared stats. I looked for a possible pattern and did some guessing. Afterwards, it was a matter of compiling and cleaning up the notes. I finished it shortly before the forums went down, although by then I was focused on updating Playership Drones, and left the weapon notes alone. I have similar notes for shields, but they are a mess, and I have not compiled them yet.
Download and Play in 1.9 beta 1...
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Star Castle Arcade: Play a classic arcade game adventure, with or without more features (like powerups)!
Playership Drones: Buy or restore exotic ships to command!

Other playable mods from 1.8 and 1.7, waiting to be updated...
Godmode v3 (WIP): Dev/cheat tool compatible with D&O parts 1 or 2.
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